Another Track Day

So I went to Nelsons Ledges again on Friday. This is a fun layout, but the track is not kept up very well and is very bumpy. The tourqeless RSXS does better here than Mid-Ohio, though. There is a long sweeping carousel right that was a constant fight between getting the front wheels to grip and turn, and keeping the back from getting too loose. We've all heard of steering with the throttle, but in FWD it's more like steering with the brakes. The radius of the turn is increasing until the apex so it's easy to come in hot, apply brakes as needed to aid steering and correct as necessary.

Only one real scare. Coming off the back straight it's easy to hit 110-115; there is a real light right which can be tricky to take at speed. You want to brake lightly right before the turn in to get weight on the front tires, but be completely back on the throttle while going through to re-balance the car. I was trying to keep up with a Boxter through this (he had gotten by me on the straight) and I told myself, I'll brake when he brakes. Well, he didn't at all so I had t do a little panic brake tap before the turn-in and coming through that little kink the back got light. A very light correction got the car stable. Definitely don't want to go off there because at 100 mph, there's only about 75 feet of grass before you smack a tire wall.

(Yes, my RSX-S is bone stock down to the air filter other than wheels/tires (Dunlop Z1 street tires wrapped around Evo IX wheels) and brakes (pads, SS lines, fluid, and cooling ducts).

Good times. Picture whoring time...





I'm pretty sure this is the aforementioned kink I was talking about.



Back straight. Fastest part of the track...







Dirty girl.



Some of the other cars that were out there:




This car was cool. Only 13 days old.



Some American iron (Yes, that's a GT500 and that C6Z06 was just stupid fast):





A quick one lap video because I put the camera on crooked and didn't realize it until I was done.

Awesome. I wish I had a car to run on the track.

Wow, that RSX sounds good, almost like it's got a V8 under the hood..... oh wait....

How come you never track the Evo?

I probably know why, I'll just let him tell you why.

Its broke.

That could be an awesome tire fire.

If i had to guess,

The EVO may still have a Warranty on it, if caught racing it could void it.

It may be in a different class that isn't as fun and it may actually cost more to race tires/mods/etc.

Plus why fuck up a good car if you can just race an older one that you don't really car about.

clockbreaker wrote:How come you never track the Evo?

Every time I post about tracking, someone asks this. For the 100th time, I took it to Mid-Ohio a few years ago, lost my brakes (the pads I put in were insufficient for the speed and weight of the car) and went off the track into a big gravel pit. Insurance covered it and it's all good now, but I don't want that to happen again.

1300ZUK wrote:If i had to guess,

The EVO may still have a Warranty on it, if caught racing it could void it.

It may be in a different class that isn't as fun and it may actually cost more to race tires/mods/etc.

Plus why fuck up a good car if you can just race an older one that you don't really car about.

The Acura is very very low maintenance when it comes to this type of driving. It's light weight and is much easier on tires, brakes, and fluids (brake and oil) than the Eclipse was (and the Evo would be even worse. Brake pads for the Evo are like 2x the Acrua). I've put five track days on one set of pads and brake fluid, where the Eclipse needed new pads and fluid after every weekend.

It's just really easy to take care of and like Zuk said, I don't have to worry about it as much. I'd rather be out there in the RSXS than not at all.

One thing about the RSX is, yea, it's not the fastest thing in the world, but it really makes the user a better driver. The Eclipse had a ton more horsepower and torque so it was easy to make up time on the straights. You could botch a corner and still be okay. Not the case with the Acura so it really makes me concentrate more on being fast through the turns, which is where the skill is.

That's why I give Spec-Miata guys a lot of credit. The races are all won and lost in the turns... whoever has the biggest balls gets the win.

Wish I could make a trip to run with ya, maybe someday, your track is quite a bit faster than the ones i've been running on.

Dodge wrote:Wish I could make a trip to run with ya, maybe someday, your track is quite a bit faster than the ones i've been running on.

Have you done any 2+ mile tracks or just autocrosses?

In this car, I am hitting about 115 both at Nelsons, and Mid-Ohio. Mid-O has a longer straight but you come onto to it quicker at Nelsons. I check that shit on the videos because I am most definitely not looking at the speedo at those times.

What kind of power is your 240 putting out? ...or your best guess anyway.

biggest track i've done so far was 1.5 miles, hoping to do roebling road next though, that'll be the first 2 mile + i've done. Highest speeds its seen on the track are 95-100 range.

I would say somewhere in the 160-170 range power wise, but running very light until the cage is in, so it gets along fairly well, be nice to get the balance back with the weight of the cage though.

I focus more on autocross just because I enjoy the competition aspect of it.

Talon wrote:

clockbreaker wrote:How come you never track the Evo?

Every time I post about tracking, someone asks this. For the 100th time, I took it to Mid-Ohio a few years ago, lost my brakes (the pads I put in were insufficient for the speed and weight of the car) and went off the track into a big gravel pit. Insurance covered it and it's all good now, but I don't want that to happen again.

You should start putting that in your signature then.

Talon wrote:

clockbreaker wrote:How come you never track the Evo?

Every time I post about tracking, someone asks this. For the 100th time, I took it to Mid-Ohio a few years ago, lost my brakes (the pads I put in were insufficient for the speed and weight of the car) and went off the track into a big gravel pit. Insurance covered it and it's all good now, but I don't want that to happen again.

Probably better it happened at the track (with a gravel pit-safety net), rather than on the road (a gazillion other cars, pedestrians, and store fronts).

the odds of pushing a car to brake fade on the street, especially a car like that, are slim to none, on a track though, pretty common

Why do only some of the people mask off their headlights? Isn't there a rule about that?

you're supposed to do it so that if your headlight gets broken, all the little bits of broken glass stay together (I.E. under the tape and off the track surface)
Although I never remember it being explicitly required at any track I went to.

Dodge wrote:the odds of pushing a car to brake fade on the street, especially a car like that, are slim to none, on a track though, pretty common

granted, but I was just sayin' is all.

just a random statement lol

SBF wrote:Why do only some of the people mask off their headlights? Isn't there a rule about that?

I do it more to protect the headlights from getting scuffed up from flying debris (rocks, rubber, bugs, etc) more than anything. I've gone without before (but I always do the fogs since they're so close to the ground). There was a rubber scuff mark on my windhsield for the longest time from a car in front of me. I eventually got it off with a razor balde but you can't exactly do that on the headlights - which are plastic, not glass btw.

I've actually been hit in the face with a piece of rubber from a Porsche GT3RS while going down the back staright at Mid-Ohio! I had my visor up and it hit me just to the left of my eye. No idea how it got in there. I drive with the visor down from now on.

Plus, Murphy's law... I started doing it and the second I don't is when something is going to happen. :jay:

Dodge wrote:the odds of pushing a car to brake fade on the street, especially a car like that, are slim to none, on a track though, pretty common

This is literally exactly what happened to me with less dire consequences:

The Virginia track has two major braking events, and both require the Z’s brakes to withstand deceleration from about 130 mph down to 40 mph. In every other car we’ve tested at VIR, brake fade emerges gradually: Longer pedal travel and extra effort required to slow for a corner serve as warnings that the brakes are getting too hot. But in the Z, with no warning, the brakes went from fully effective to missing in action in a single, disastrous stop from 130 mph. The pedal collapsed to the floor, and what remained of the braking power was only able to slow the car at a rate very much like stopping on snow. Fortunately, no one was injured when the brakeless missile introduced itself to a retaining wall so enthusiastically that it had to be removed using heavy equipment.

http://www.caranddriver.com/features/09q4/lightning_lap_2009-feature/ll2_3a_2009_nissan_nismo_370z_3e_3_3a12.0_page_8

Mid-Ohio is very hard on brakes. It also has a 130+mph straight into a 40mph turn. I did have aftermarket pads in, but apparently they weren't up to snuff. One minute I had brakes, and coming off the back straight I didn't any more. That sucked.

People give me weird looks when I say brakes are the first thing you should upgrade when preparing to track a car, but its true to the core.

Heat control is the main aspect of it, stock cars have VERY little in the way of air ducting to cool the brakes, since in street conditions, there is virtually no need.

Dodge wrote:People give me weird looks when I say brakes are the first thing you should upgrade when preparing to track a car, but its true to the core.

Heat control is the main aspect of it, stock cars have VERY little in the way of air ducting to cool the brakes, since in street conditions, there is virtually no need.

I couldn't agree more. Brakes and tires, brakes and tires, brakes and tires! Not sure if you can tell from any of the photos, but I also have brake ducting under the car leading to the calipers. That's all that is done to the car. Bone stock, but SS lines, fluid, Hawk pads, cooling ducts, and wheels/tires. Just the essentials.

The Evo didn't have brake ducts either. I don't even want to think about it because there are a dozen things I could have done to prevent what happened, but sometimes you have to learn the hard way and what's done is done.

The Eclipse also had brake ducts comeing back from the fog light holes. I had to take the fog lights out beacuse the FMIC/piping required it, but a 3" tube of ducting fit perfectly in the holes. It was actually pretty bad ass.

I do recall that

Talon wrote:

SBF wrote:Why do only some of the people mask off their headlights? Isn't there a rule about that?

I do it more to protect the headlights from getting scuffed up from flying debris (rocks, rubber, bugs, etc) more than anything. I've gone without before (but I always do the fogs since they're so close to the ground). There was a rubber scuff mark on my windhsield for the longest time from a car in front of me. I eventually got it off with a razor balde but you can't exactly do that on the headlights - which are plastic, not glass btw.

I've actually been hit in the face with a piece of rubber from a Porsche GT3RS while going down the back staright at Mid-Ohio! I had my visor up and it hit me just to the left of my eye. No idea how it got in there. I drive with the visor down from now on.

Plus, Murphy's law... I started doing it and the second I don't is when something is going to happen. :jay:

I know some car clubs have a track days only headlight tape-up clause or some crap. I figured it was something related to minimize damage to the headlights. I also heard that vintage car clubs require everyone that has exposed sealed beams to be taped up on track days.

I was just curious.

I would not want to do any type of racing with stock brakes. Just from driving on the street I can tell that the weakest link of my WRX is definitely the brakes. Not that they suck or anything, but they aren't up to par with the performance of the rest of the car.

clockbreaker wrote:I would not want to do any type of racing with stock brakes. Just from driving on the street I can tell that the weakest link of my WRX is definitely the brakes. Not that they suck or anything, but they aren't up to par with the performance of the rest of the car.

That's why the STI comes with these.

yeah theyre sweet. but that would be big money adding those. maybe i could get away with better pads.

At Laguna Seca I lost the brakes pretty early on, coming into the tight left-hander that comes into the start of the uphill straight. From that point on I was able to able to put the pedal to the floor even while stationary. The funny thing is that although the brakes never really came back and I had to brake about halfway down the straights, the grunt and grip of the Mustang still allowed me to overtake a lot of decent cars (Boxster, Cayman S, E46 M3).
I would actually put the auto gearbox before the lack of brakes as the biggest thing holding back really quick lap times.

Oh and I lost my brakes in the MR2 a couple of weeks before going on holiday. The brake fluid mysteriously dropped way below the minimum line. I was incredibly fortunate that the brakes disappeared in a back road full of speed bumps. Engine braking was more effective than actual braking (I timed a 40km/h - 20km/h slowdown using each method) so if it had caught me off guard in traffic I would have rear-ended someone for sure.

I'm not trying to jack any threads but about 30 mins. away they are building a road course and I'm excited. I have the link and was wondering what you guys think about it. It's the only real road course near my location that I know of the rest are a small rally race in northern Maine and Parking lot courses on Portland.

http://www.clubmotorsports.com/

Valley Motorsports Park

Club Motorsports presents - Valley Motorsports Park, a member's only country club for performance cars and motorcycles. Our "ribbon through the woods" blends art and science with heart pounding adrenaline - testing your driving skills. Road course features:

3.3 mile full circuit course with 18 turns
36 to 40 foot wide road surface
150 to 200 feet of corner runoff area
Over 390 feet of elevation change
Alan Wilson design with multiple configurations
1.9 mile West Course
1.4 mile East Course
Timing and control tower
Video on demand system
Large, dedicated vehicles dynamics training area
Professional driving school and personalized instruction
Garage and technician service
Vehicle maintenance
Paddock Suites
Paddock Clubhouse
Locker room and shower facilities
Upper clubhouse and hotel with all the amenities - pool, tennis, restaurant & lounge, spa & health club, and more

Valley Motorsports Park is located in Tamworth, NH in the beautiful White Mountains.



I'm kinda excited

Membership better not be a lot or else its gay....for real.

I think this might be RAPE. but then again I don't know what it costs for the road courses you guys use.

http://www.clubmotorsports.com/memberships/index.cfm?ac=compareindividual

Which level of individual membership is right for you? The following chart compares the three levels of individual memberships available at Club Motorsports™. Club Motorsports™ is pleased to offer the ultimate individual membership level – the Platinum Membership.

Individual Membership Privileges Platinum Gold Silver Bronze
Total number of annual driving sessions available 150 80 40 20

Fuck these guys!!!! I'm glad I don't read shit before I post .

Initiation Fees must be paid before joining....

http://www.clubmotorsports.com/memberships/index.cfm?ac=paymentplan

THat's odd... I've never seen that before. Of course you have to pay track dues, but not for a year. You should see if any local clubs end up going there, like NASA or SCCA. I go to Nelsons with a local Porsche club.

It's not who you are, it's who you know...

They still have a ways to go. They've had court problems that have held them up due to wet lands near by and possible noise complaints from locals. I'll definitely check when they open and try to find some local clubs too.

zdc_LarryRX wrote:
Valley Motorsports Park is located in Tamworth, NH in the beautiful White Mountains.



I'm kinda excited

That looks like a pretty badass track. Sorta reminds me of Road America and Road Atlanta mashed together.

We'll see, its just a bunch of dirt right now lol. A nice rally track

Looks fun. In my opinion any new track should rip off at least one famously tricky corner from classic. With so many corners on the track above, they need to slot one in.